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Magpies

To answer a common question I'm being asked since Monday, the Patreon-exclusive comics stay up permanently. I wouldn't think of removing them after a certain amount of time or anything torturous like that. I also wanted to share my friend's final assignment for her graphic design class. You can read all the other self-indulgent pointless and repetitive questions, but I'd love to get some feedback on question 6 in particular. I omitted her answers to these, but she can plug them in the comments if she feels so inclined to out herself. ART 130 FINAL ASSIGNMENT 1. What are the 3 biggest insights you gained about the Principles of Design by taking this course? 2. What 3 things did you learn about the Graphic Design Process (think about the different smaller assignments that helped you develop a final product like the shapes project or logo project or poster project)? 3. What was the biggest insight you gained from learning the tools of our trade? 4. What 3 things did you learn from the lectures/book? 5. What are the 2 most important insights you gained by completing each of the following projects (write two for each project or 12 total): 6. Finally, what did you learn by watching your fellow classmates presentations on their artists? What did most of these artists have in common? Considering that they were in their 20’s when they did much of their work, and many of you are in your 20’s, why aren't you doing similarly influential work in your disciplines by now? They didn't have more means than you in many cases, and frankly lived in much more turbulent and difficult times... What are the biggest differences between these artists and you? Consider the following points before you answer: • They didn't have computers or the technology you have. • Many of them lived during turbulent wars or periods of conflict. • They didn't have the internet and yet they were aware of what was happening in their industry… Consider that the only thing standing in the way of you becoming the best graphic designer you can be is you. Not your situation, not your tools, not your teachers, but you. Consider for a moment what each of the artists was willing to give to become as great as they were... consider what they did with their idle time. How they spent their youth... what they were able to accomplish at such a young age... etc   There are so many things wrong with this being a final assignment, I'm not really sure where to start. But the most egregious and insulting thing to me is the tired "generational guilt" running rampant these days. Yeah it's been around forever, but what business does this professor have cashing in his/her paychecks from students paying her salary, then turn around and feel the need to burden them with guilt that's not theirs to bare? I absolutely have no tolerance for garbage like this. None. There is no reason to shame people for things they're not responsible for, and can't help. And obviously we're not just talking about an art class, but it's everywhere these days. People feel so compelled to shame others for crimes they never committed, and being born in X Y or Z like it's their fault.. It''s absolutely nauseating. I had a friend on Facebook asking "any Irish friends" if they were offended by Notre Dame's mascot. She received the unanimous answer of "Hell no." Then she continued her inquiry by saying "Well are you a leprechaun? Do you constantly guard gold?" I'm not even kidding. She's trying to point out exactly what others should be offended by. We've got to drop this stuff. I usually don't go on tears or rants about stuff (on this site atleast) but dafuq?? The last thing the world needs is another person finding things for people to be mad about. Or feel bad about. Everyone shouldn't live in perpetual guilt, shame, or anger. No one needs help being told how to feel.

206 thoughts on “Magpies

    1. EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
      EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEeeeeee
      eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

      (OK this is insane. At some point either I’m going to be slapped, get boots thrown at my head, dogs will mob the streets and birds around the world will go of course and whales will do the macarena.

      But when will this replace that dial up modem sound?

  1. Those cookies look so much better than Girl Scout cookies…and probably cost less also. I’ll take 4 boxes of Rope-A-Dopes and 10 of the Do-Si-Don’ts!!! I don’t need any more despair right now…

        1. Frank, relax. Now tell me why the North Korean’s would have Magpie Scout cookies? My wife was a Magpie for G-d’s sake Frank.

        2. …um…yeah…yeah, you’re right, sir! Go right ahead! Have the hooks!

          …this idiot’s going to get himself killed. And when he does, I’ll be right there to get promoted into the 4077th. Then…then I can finally have Hawkeye shot. Yes. Enjoy your cookies, you ridiculous boob.

  2. Wow, Danny is HORRIBLE with money management. If Squid Boy is Caleb then I can only assume that Goth Girl is Vu and the blood on her hands is Danny’s after they eviserate him.

  3. Danny, um…you might be bigger than them, but there’s four of them. And one of you.

    And the LAST thing you want to say to a crowd of girl scout knockoffs is how you plan to take your belt off around them. All it takes is one of them to scream “PREVERT!” in the Getmart parking lot and you are SO screwed. I doubt Caleb wants to post your bail.

    1. Danny deserves a good thrashing, especially from little girls. Every time this guy appears, he redefines the word jerk.

        1. I remember that show.
          I hear Nick At Night is running all the MTM series. We cut the cord though so I am not gonna see it.

    1. I bet that’s a common schoolyard counter.

      “I’ll call my mom! She’s a bitch! Rosemary Buckingham checks under the bed every night to make sure MY MOM ISN’T THERE!”

  4. Assuming that Danny is telling the truth then my opinion of him decreases only slightly, in that he’s an ass but he’s at least obeying the rules.

    If he’s lying though, which seems likely, then he just lost a lot of sympathy points in my book.

    1. I don’t think he’d be telling the truth about having the spot reserved somehow and then back down that fast. Instead it’d be a, “Please do and I’ll give her the contact information so she can properly schedule your event next time.”

  5. Hahahahah that girl scout is cracking me up! totally called Danny’s bluff. I love it

    I also love girl scout cookies …I really want some now.

    1. Oh man, some girlscout cookies would really hit the spot right now. I don’t even care what kind, I won’t discriminate, as long as I have those delectable discs of deliciousness to cram in my cheeks.

      1. What’s crazy, is that one of the local small businesses who specialize in Men’s Big and Tall also have girl scout cookies. And I just remembered that there should be a girl scout outlet in that same shopping center. Maybe they have cookies.

    1. I’d watch out for that one in the back.

      And that redhead’s got Sanpaku eyes. Look at them; white above and below the pupil.

        1. I’d be concerned for Danny’s safety if he hadn’t come to his senses and thrown out a payoff.

        2. After him trying to pull off this stunt, I wouldn’d be concerned for his safety even if he didn’t.

          That is to say I wouldn’t really care, even if he was mangled by a bunch of piranha poodles.

        3. It’s Danny. It’s not a question of if he’s done something to deserve getting mangled, just a question of what he’s done today to deserve it.

        4. Additionally, pirrana poodles would be entertaining. And possibly a sign of Cinn was inspired by the ratches to try to dabble in more animal mashups to help perpetuate HER evil.

        5. But if you give them meat (or a meat-like substance) that’s been laced with the special flowers, they fall asleep.

        6. Thank you Mechwarrior! I was wondering if someone would catch that. :D

          Friend of mine recently wore a swordmaster t-shirt. Got a good laugh out of me.

  6. Soul-Patch Danny: Bully *and* idiot.

    Help me out, people. Is there any part of this character that I should be liking? Are there any redeeming features I should be remembering?

    1. Danny is kind of great. Basically every strip he’s in he’s helping someone out. In this one he buys a whole shipment of girl scout cookies.

    2. He’s… never resorted to violence or anything illegal? Has not outright walked out on Ellie “Bitch won’t put out anyway tonight!” even after finding Pumpkin with her in the hotel room?

      Sorry, apart from those, I’m pretty much pulling a blank here.

    3. He’s definitely not supposed to be on anyone’s good list just now. Whether or not he continues on a permanent slow downard trajectory, makes a big plummet, pulls himself up, or just occasionally shames other characters when they realize they were worse than him is undetermined.

  7. Calling all those kids dumb, then trying to intimidate “girl scouts.” Danny’s dubious reputation continues to deteriorate.

  8. Answer to Question #6: There are a lot of differences between myself and artists of the past. For one, those lucky bastards had far less competition, alternate media, and piracy to deal with than I do. They were also able to make art without fear of roving bands of sensitive people looking for something to be offended by. Some of them might have even had their First Amendment rights defended by the ACLU instead of suppressed! In fact, they could put up a piece of art that expressed something personal without loading it up with some bull$#!t social message to sell it. They wouldn’t even get a lecture on how their failure to “raise awareness” is a waste of their time in the spotlight!

    That is why, for my presentation, I have depicted myself punching Pablo Picasso in the crotch. Because %@#$ that guy. He had it too easy.

    1. My turn, my turn.

      -1) First, I learned to sleep with my eyes open.
      -2) These artists were able to take in nutrients and oxygen and convert said intake into pee and poop.
      -3) Maybe because we are still approaching a level of sophistication in our work where they were able to go out drinking
      every night and come back in and sell paint and paper to people at large and make somewhat of a living at it.
      Also, the cost of living was much less back then. So, sit on it.
      -4) I live in the here and now with a stupid idiot for a professor who thinks that sacrificing dictates a level of artistic
      sophistication. Wake up and watch Bewitched.
      -5a) They may not have had computers or technology, so they had to get their job done right the first time, or at least
      be able to incorporate the mistake by claiming that it was their style. Then they got saddled with that lump
      of a monkey.
      -5b) They may have lived in times of turbulent wars, conflict and such, yet people were always traveling into and out
      of their region, so they were able to keep up with the information as it almost happened. Because knowledge
      is power. And knowing is half the battle.
      -5c) They were aware of their industry, because they lived and worked in areas of population concentration required
      to necessitate the travel required to help to disseminate the required information needed. Oh, and that
      means that they needed the help of the blue bloods. The industry was made up of them, and there was
      very little separation between the technology and their artistic application, because the standards were not
      set, and probably being shaped by the artists themselves.
      -6) Those artists were able to accomplish what they did because they drank the green fairy and helped Baz Lurman
      to make a movie.

  9. In response to Rusche’s final assignment comments:

    I’m a white male with no particular talents born into a middle class family.

    People go on about privilege and white guilt, and I tell them how black people have been in positions of authority my entire life and have actively oppressed me and made racist comments again and again and again. They’ve tried to kick me out of school for holding my hands behind my back and letting a black, or hispanic, or even other white kids beat me for a while, claiming that I was fighting back when I never once did, no matter how many witnesses saw that fact.

    I tell them about how I was so depressed from a sense of worthlessness for so long and just kept dealing with it that my body started actually bleeding in strange places, as if to convince me to kill myself.

    I tell them that the reason I don’t take advantage of my birth is because I had more problems to deal with than a normal person ought to, and to this day I still find social interactions difficult as people constantly tell me I’m too blunt, I’m not patient enough, I take too long to get to the point, I’m impolite, I’m too angry, I avoid people too much, and other such things.

    Do I come back and tell them to their faces that they’ve lived a charmed life, not having to deal with this happy fantasy of a bullet in their own brains putting an end to all their strife every time they dream at night? Of course I do. If I were such a good person that I wouldn’t do that, the social interaction thing wouldn’t be an issue. I rub it in their face because it causes them to shut up. I also do so because I align myself with “evil”.

    “Evil” is just another word for those oppressed. The losers. The victims. Even those that fire the first shot and lose are victims in the end, because humanity needs something to call evil. That puts them on a pedestal of evil and thus makes them something that must be hated for the greater good. There are oppressors and there are the oppressed. Those two groups shift nonstop, played by endless actors, until the world stops spinning. I’m no different and neither is anyone else.

    What makes me different, if anything, is I don’t like to carry on with some false sense of justice. They are not greater than me and they are not inferior to me. They’re just deeply flawed human beings who play out their role because they don’t know any better. The wisest thing I’ve ever heard is “Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.” It recognises the dilemma and tries to solve it. But human beings are incapable of that, needing something to oppress, and now many of them choose to attempt to oppress former oppressors. Unabashedly, but without admittance of their own wrongdoing in that act alone because the point is to fulfill their needs, not to punish wrongdoers. It would defeat the purpose to recognise hypocrisy, which is why people don’t typically do it.

    People are full of hate. That’s the natural state of humanity. Kindness is just a mask people wear for those they love, and those white knights who go on about loving humanity are the ones who hate humanity the most. I know because I was one of them once. But no matter how nice you are to people, and no matter how much you try to share wisdom with them, they’ll never grow from that point of sacrificing others for their own psychological need to be right.

    That’s why forgiveness is the greatest state of being that we can hope to achieve, even if it’s impossible. We can have our opinions and act contrary to how we want to, but we need to forgive others and not hate ourselves just because other people want us to feel bad about ourselves. I was born with a lot of advantages, but far more disadvantages and it’s arrogant to assume that it’s so easy to overcome them or they don’t exist at all. That Professor has lived a charmed life and should feel ashamed. If they can’t be forgiven, despite me never having met them and it not directly affecting me, it’s because I’m only human. I accept the hypocrisy of my statements.

    1. “Privilege” is a excuse for being a failure invented by bigots who, hilariously, think they’re enlightened. I’m sorry you’ve been subjected to that crap.

    2. LOL, what? Just because you had a hard life doesn’t mean being white isn’t an advantage (at least in the USA). Not that that means you’re a bad person. Just saying, if you’re white, you’re probably better off than a black person. Even if sometimes a white guy has a black boss who is a dick.

      Anyway, am I wrong, or was the ending to that last arch only on patreon? Anyone care to summarize?

      1. I’d like to note that, while you observe that Anonanon is at an advantage being white, that’s not the same as saying Anonanon owes anything to non-white people, which is how others are likely to take it going forward in this discussion.

        Good luck…

        1. Haha, good one! (that was my point – you didn’t – let’s see who argues with you assuming that you did)

      2. I never said being white isn’t an advantage. I said that your birth means absolutely nothing as to who you are compared to your experiences. People like you see the world in a closed shell, as if skin color defines everything. The term for that is “racist”.

        Look up nature versus nurture then come back with your ignorant opinions, Nick. Maybe then they won’t be so racist.

        If you want me to say my actual opinion on the matter outside of you being a racist (which is a fact, not a personal judgment on good or evil, as I think being ignorant and racist isn’t necessarily a bad thing, just a product of your environment), then I will: Being white is not an advantage. Being human is an advantage. I’d rather be an african-nativeamerican-eskimo-aboriginal than a goddamn poodle, because as a human I gain the ability to use my thumbs and have a brain bigger than a walnut. To that end, I think the differences in privilege between a white dude and a black dude in the usa are as small as the difference between a poodle and a pug, to use a simple analogy I haven’t researched much.

        More people want poodles, but pugs have their own positive traits as well. They may not live in the lap of luxury like poodles, but not only does not every poodle get to live a happy life, not every pug lives a shitty life. You can talk about statistics all you want, but to that I reply: Poodles live a sheltered life, and is there nothing more important to self-important people like you than wisdom? Pugs are more wise because they’ve experienced hardship. If they destroy themselves in the process, that’s partially their fault and partially a proclivity toward that due to their environment.

        However if environment were actually everything, I wouldn’t still be alive right now. It’s not my environment that made me strong enough to keep myself alive, nor was it my birth. It was simply a desire to live and to be happy with a certain kind of ethical hangup about robbing people and then blaming the cops when I get stopped.

        And that’s where it becomes clear I’m just a lowly little human being: Look at all the people I’ve looked down on in this message. I’m declaring them evil, yet all of them have declared something else evil. Except pugs, but, you know, they’re stupid. You call white people evil, white people call you evil, black people call cops evil, cops call everyone who isn’t a cop evil… it’s a generalization but it’s true.

        1. Hmm. Okay, you sound young. You’re a bit ignorant and you’re assuming a lot of things about me and about people who complain about disparities in our society. I know this SOUNDS condescending, but I’m not trying to be. In fact, judging by your writing, you sound pretty smart.

          Yes, being white is an advantage. It doesn’t mean being white will solve all problems (my mother is white, and she had a HARD life growing up). And yes, black people can have an easier life (for example, my father who was born to somewhat more fortunate circumstances than my mother! [my father is black]).

          Unfortunately, race is a big factor in the world we live in. If you have darker skin, you’re more likely to have a harder time. This should stop. It CAN be fixed, but first we need to stop pretending it doesn’t exist. Contrary to popular belief, most black people don’t think whites, cops, or white cops are EVIL. If fact, as a black person, you’re much more likely to have a variety of friends outside of one’s own ethnicity. You know, since black people are MINORITIES who happen to live in urban environments with more diversity. But because they are much more often the targets of racism and abuse by government agents (police, FBI, etc.), many know first hand that racism still exists.

          Please, don’t get defensive. No one’s asking you to feel guilty, because YOU didn’t do anything. All I ask is that you try to understand that racism and prejudice are things SJW’s made up back in 2012 so they could have something to complain about. They are REAL. And the only way to deal with them is to acknowledge their existence.

          Also, that dog metaphor needs work.

        2. You have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about. People in urban environments tend to live in clusters of like people, typically by race or country of origin.
          .
          Maybe I should throw in a shot at your age to imply you’re inexperienced, but it’s easier to just point out you’re speaking abstractly and expecting everyone to just assume your opinions are fact or research based.

        3. Either that or you made some really horrible errors in your last paragraph and are suffering for lack of an edit button. You may want to re-read it.

        4. What? I grew up in the city. Boston, actually, one city that is famous for its racism. Sure, we tend to live (although not as much now, with all the yuppies and hipsters moving in) in circles of our own. But we venture outside of those circles everyday. Outsiders travel into the city every day to do business, work a job, teach a class, see the sights, whatever.

          As for facts, research, etc., it would be redundant for me to site any, since there is so much already available. Just google it. If you’re black in America, there’s a good chance you’re screwed.

        5. I was referring to absurd statements like “black people have more diverse friends because they are minorities who live in citiies” which you’re now contradicting (by saying your city is racist). That kind of statement is an opinion based on nothing, not a fact/research-based statement.
          I was entirely unaware that people made friends solely by being outnumbered where they lived. In fact, to the contrary, many people make friends in schools which are intentionally integrated. Racism is also something that has to be taught, which means that not being around a certain type of people doesn’t automatically make you hate them. You may also be surprised to learn that exposure to other races is not a prerequisite to being open-minded, nor does it “always help” because bad experiences can lead to racism.
          .
          Also, you should seriously reread what you wrote earlier. I am fairly certain racism pre-dates 2012.

        6. That’s not what he said. It isn’t an opinion based on nothing and therefore something to be called out and ridiculed because it’s not what he said. I can understand the confusion because it’s in quotation marks, but I can assure you I didn’t find that string of text in his comments at all.

          Also yes, he clearly typoed “are” instead of “aren’t”. You pointed out once already, it’s not really noteworthy anymore.

        7. The quoted bit about friends is what he said. No amount of denying it’s there will prevent people from scrolling up and seeing it. I don’t trust you over my eyes.

        8. What he said was different from what you said. No amount of misusing quotation marks will change that.

          The quoted bit was a statement in your words, that you called “absurd”, said he was “contradicting”, said it was an “opinion based on nothing”, and said it wasn’t a “fact/research-based statement” (the quotation marks are because those are the words you used). The fact that you ridicule “what he said” for not fitting such criteria shows that you completely missed the point. He wasn’t presenting it as a factual thing, he was offering an explanation/observation based on personal experience (yes you can argue on that basis, but you weren’t – you were ridiculing your interpretation of his opinion, among other things, for being an opinion).

          I understand that we are all different people, beautiful and unique snowflakes if you will, and so we all interpret things differently. But that’s why you should use caution when you quote people or accuse them of what they meant when they said a thing. Telling him earlier that he “[expects] everyone to just assume [his] opinions are fact or research based” is a perfect example – at no point did he indicate such intentions, at least not to deserve such an accusation. You’re not arguing with Nick anymore, you’re arguing with a strawman of your own creation.

          And me. But I don’t want to argue.
          Maybe we could sing a showtune instead or something? :)

        9. What he said: “…as a black person, you’re much more likely to have…”
          What you ‘quoted’ him saying: “…black people have…”

          Not the same thing.

        10. Dropping a single use of weasel words while paraphrasing is not inverting the entire meaning of a statement which, even if I’d left the “much more likely” in, would still be opinion based on nothing. No amount of denying the obvious as verbosely as possible will change that. No amount of acting as though your approval or agreement is necessary will make that so, either.

        11. @boog – In the spirit of being argumentative I’ll say “beautiful and unique snowflakes” is wrong and should just be “unique snowflakes”.

          Showtunes, hmmm… Is picking “Springtime for Hitler” from The Producers a Godwin or not? If so, I could be persuaded to switch to Chim-chim-er-ee.

        12. @Gravatarless: “Dropping a single use of weasel words while paraphrasing”

          See that’s the thing about paraphrasing, you can’t paraphrase while simultaneously using quotation marks and insisting that your opponent said what you are saying they said. Also – I don’t know what you mean by “weasel words” – that just sounds like people aren’t free to make the opinions/arguments they want, only the select few arguments/opinions you will let them.

          “No amount of denying the obvious as verbosely as possible will change that.”

          Which of us is denying the obvious here? Based on everything Nick said, it was an explanation/observation, opinion if you insist, based on personal experience, not nothing. And the verbosity wouldn’t be necessary if you weren’t so stubborn. Or maybe that just makes a detailed response to you pointless?

          And I honestly don’t want to argue like this so please stop insisting that your interpretation is the obvious one. IT MAKES IT SEEM like you think your approval or agreement is necessary for people to have different interpretations than you do. Which brings me to this:

          “No amount of acting as though your approval or agreement is necessary will make that so, either.”

          Oh man, what is it LIKE thinking you have everyone all figured out, better than they themselves? Is it nice? I bet it’s nice.

          @That One Guy: I’ll allow it!

        13. I’m going to quote an extremely non-PC comic who’s dead here (Greg Giraldo). He said something along the following lines:

          “I saw pictures of a man trying to save his family floating on a car door. Hurricane Katrina really exposed the poverty in the US. I mean, so much of the time poor people just look like black people…”

          To be honest economics is what I find to be much more relevant than race for the validity of a lot of stereotypes, and a lot of black stereotypes seem to match up more with persistent generational poverty rather than skin tone.

          As for the friend diversity likelihood, I’d say it’s by your social groups. In college my dorm social group was predominantly white and one black guy and one Indian guy. The residents of the dorm were >80% white. I suspect those two had more white friends simply due to the fact that there were a lot more white people they associated with. I, also, had more white friends for that reason.

        14. It all depends on your experiences and how you take them. Most of the people I grew up around, went to school with, and have worked with were white. Most of my friends haven’t been. Just looking at a count of types of people you’re exposed to is irrelevant to if the opinions you may form about their [whatever] is going to be positive or negative.

        15. Granted, the count of the people in arbitrary groupings you’re around doesn’t require that you’ll agree with the largest grouping. However you definitely do have more chance to either agree or disagree with the largest grouping, and if the groupings are based upon something that isn’t actually a basis for agreement or disagreement (such as skin tone), then all other things being equal you’re more likely to agree with more of the largest group. Granted, all other things are never absolutely equal and are sometimes quite unequal, and even if they’re close to equal there are still statistical outliers, but it’s a fair first order estimation that if >80% of the people you associate with are white then in the general case it wouldn’t be surprising for >50% of your friends to be white. Not to say that’s proof and things have to work that way, just that barring some other factor, the raw numbers make it more likely, and no matter how the numbers work there’s still someone who wins the lottery occasionally, so, like any statistical approximation, it’s not going to be universal.

        16. As well as being taken much more seriously when you’ve done your research, and have other supporting articles to your viewpoints being tested/hypothesized.

        17. I lived in a community of such minorities, and grew up with many blacks. I have a handful of black people on facebook and my brother-in-law is black. For your information, I’m also one of those ‘minorities’ you spoke of. I just have more of a proclivity toward being white than being Cuban, so I choose to align myself with my American roots instead of my Cuban roots.

          There’s a deep distrust in the black community of the police not only because of historic prejudice but prejudice that still continues today. However, what is there to be gained in the black community from that prejudice? Simple: The moral high ground. If there is an injustice, and they oppose that injustice, then they have the moral high ground, and that has the potential to change the course of history. Some squander that through racism or overextending of that moral high ground, leading to complaints about injustices that aren’t injustices but rather simple inconveniences.

          If history is built on sacrifice of previous generations, then if there is something unfair it’s that black people have had to sacrifice much more than most other races to achieve their ends. Yet that could be blamed on their ancestry not making proper records of their history at the dawn of civilization. Word of mouth only took them so far and they were behind technologically for an incredibly long time because of it. If you choose to build a ton of archers instead of libraries in civilization games then you tend to get behind technologically. It’s the same simple principle they didn’t fundamentally understand. Either through happenstance, religion, or a legitimate need to defend against others of african descent, they chose not to build libraries, from my understanding of african history until the middle ages when mansa musa’s islamic tendencies kicked in.

          History isn’t racist. It’s merely telling facts. Humans oppressing you is what happens when you’re in a system with other humans. No, even animals are the same: Every ecosystem has winners and losers. It usually has nothing to do with the losers being weak, but the winners being strong. The winners oppress the losers. That’s the natural state of things. Black people may not be in the lead, but they’re definitely moving faster than white people are. If they just capitalize on their moral high ground, they will undoubtedly pass white people, or at least catch up properly. The USA’s laws are on their side. It’s just the police are racist.

          I interviewed a police officer once. I forget his actual rank but he was higher than an ordinary officer, so that’s somewhat of a misnomer. In any case, due to his stupidity, he divulged certain practices to me: They specifically look for black men who come into his area on a train with little luggage alone because people who come in such situations tend to be drug dealers from New York. Not just anyone. Just black people. They don’t bother stalking the others, but they actually actively stalk young black men who come in such circumstances to perform a raid on wherever they stay some time later. It may have yielded results, but it’s still racial profiling. Not profiling with race as part of the profile, but just racial profiling.

        18. Buddy, no offense. But your third paragraph there is not much more historically accurate than me saying that Earth was created five minutes ago by a farting oxen. I’d strongly advise doing some research into both the colonisation era in Africa and what it meant for local structures, as well as the continent’s history before that. They were hardly uneducated barbarians in loincloths everywhere and -time as is often purported to some higher or lower degree.

        19. That being said, most early cultures up to and including the middle ages are usually vastly underestimated as of today.

        20. I never said that they were barbarians. They just didn’t keep libraries. They shared things by word of mouth. Unless you’re talking about Egypt. But I’m talking about West Africa.

        21. So forgetting about most of Africa and it’s residents. Didn’t sound that way at first. But even there, you’re partially wrong. And where you aren’t, you’re still missing the actual reasons behind the technology gap. “They decided not to build libraries. That’s why they were behind.” is just.. well plain wrong. It simply cannot be reduced to this.
          And to anyone annoyed about me not writing out the full story: I’m sorry about that. Would if I could, but a comments section like this just does’nt leave enough space for it. Nor is it the right place to do so anyway.

        22. I think that you are losing credibility with your broad generalizations and some slightly absurdist analogies that seemed for the Beyer pay to have been pulled out of a rectal sphincter.

        23. Evidence for what exactly? There being a number of empires in West Africa as well, that were absolutely on top for their time? Their literacy levels? The reasons for a technological gap between most Europeans and West Africans at the beginning of the colonial era?

          Anyway. To find evidence, you might want to look into the latter. Also check out things like the Ghana Empire, Almoravid dynasty, Sosso, Mali, Songhai just to name a few. Maybe start with the Nok even. Really, check it out yourself. Not just wikipedia but find a library, look up some good books about those. As I said, this is not really the place for me to elaborate. Nor is there even halfway enough space for it.

        24. Wait wait wait… you got on my case for dropping three weasel words when you were backing up boog’s hollow, pedantic dismissal of what I said, but now you’re inventing “[Africans] were hardly uneducated barbarians in loincloths everywhere” from “they were behind on technology” and “they didn’t build libraries”?
          .
          The problem with intellectual dishonesty is it really, really stands out when you break your own false standards on the same page of arguments.

        25. Funny. If you read my post a bit more carefully, you’ll find I never claimed he said that. I said that it is a picture many people still try to paint even nowadays, at least partially (you did notice the part where I specified that latter part, right?). And I hinted (or tried to) at him maybe being influenced by such.

        26. Oh look, more pedantic technicalities. I never said you said he said that (to play your game). You paraphrased what he said to an extreme degree that he never approached. Playing with words won’t change the fact that you’re just looking for any excuse to dismiss what you disagree with out of hand, so you don’t care that your past and present behavior are in conflict.

        27. Since you’re obviously not really reading what I’m writing or what I’m trying to explain. Instead just seeing what you desperately want to see while doing exactly what you incriminate others of. I do not see any reason to continue this with you after this message. Nor any worth in trying to argue with you in general as long as you keep this up.
          You make a good troll though. But that’s basically what I’ve said with my first two sentences.

        28. So you’re basically reiterating what I pointed out about your behavior as verbosely as possible, dismissing what I said out of hand, and trying to pass yourself off as the better person. Oh yeah. I’m definitely a troll. There’s no way I could genuinely be offended by someone willfully being dishonest while speaking down to people. No. I must be trolling.

        29. @Gravatarless: “never said you said he said that (to play your game).”

          Actually, you did accuse him of misquoting. You made quite a show of it too, even breaking out the boldface to try to drive your point home. You must have felt proud, triumphant, like a child tying his first shoelace. Your enemy lies in ruin at your feet, bound by the one thing he had been using all along to confound you – being all twisty, and… and stringy.

          Only there is a problem. Lukkai in fact didn’t quote him, he didn’t repeatedly say “that’s what he said”, he didn’t do any of the things you did that you are trying to turn around on him. He didn’t even claim to paraphrase him (I mean, I’m glad to see you are referring to your quote as paraphrasing, now you just need to get better at paraphrasing without distorting the original message for your own purposes).

          And nobody’s playing with words here, nobody’s dismissing your views out of hand, nobody’s talking down, being dishonest, passing themselves off as the better pers- JEEZE man, take a breath, go for a walk, just calm yourself down. People can freaking disagree, that doesn’t mean they’re out to get you.

        30. That being said I never judged you nor boog in any kind of way. Merely pointed out where you quoted him wrong (and that misquote makes for quite a big difference). No more, no less. So really, you can stuff that attitude.

        31. I didn’t quote him, I paraphrased him. Furthermore, my argument is the same whether you apply it to what he literally said rather than my summary. That is why it was hollow and pedantic of you both to whine about a minor technicality my argument never hinged on.

        32. Since I already wrote this out:

          Since you say they’re the same, why don’t we apply the two formulations “to be much more like to do/have” and “do/have” to another sentence then.

          “People are much more likely to die if they walk down a street.”
          “People die if they walk down a street.”

          I hope this makes it clear that your changes went way past paraphrasing.

        33. I notice you have artfully dodged the fact my argument would have been exactly the same whether aimed at my paraphrase or his original statement. I note further that claimed I said both statements were the same when I actually said my argument was the same regardless which statement it was aimed at. Lastly I can’t overlook the fact you’ve avoided actually disproving my point that you grossly exaggerated Anonymousanonymous when you tried turning this around on me.
          .
          You are layering willful dishonesty on top of intellectual dishonesty at this point while pretending to be the better person.

        34. @Gravatarless:
          Call it hollow or pedantic if you will, but a major pet peeve of mine is when a person states an opinion, and somebody else basically says “you meant this” and attacks them for it. Some people do it to be jerks (I don’t think you are a jerk), and some people do it because their “opponent” didn’t offer them an appropriate opportunity to state their own opinion (which is what I think you’re doing here, possibly unwittingly). In either case, it frustrates me to no end.

          Calling it a “minor technicality [that your] argument never hinged on” only supports my theory of what you’re doing. Nick’s actual opinion wasn’t what you wanted to argue with, so you left out three words (among other changes that you refuse to acknowledge), and now, magically, his opinion was a baseless statement, and a hasty generalization that is obviously wrong and you get to be the one to shoot it down.

          I get it, having a point you want to argue that nobody wants to argue with you, I feel this way all the time myself, but forcing people to defend arguments/opinions that they didn’t quite make is not the answer.

          Now, who wants to join me in a round of “If I Were a Rich Man”?

        35. Yes, the dog metaphor needs extensive rewrites. Poodles were considered a working class of dog, weren’t they?

          I just checked, and they were utilized as a water retriever.

        36. Yup. Those are hunting dogs, originally.

          Unlike the pug, who originally was an emperor’s dog. High nobility and people with enough money to buy into those circles only.

        37. Interesting. I made it up on the spot, like I do with a lot of analogies. Still, like the high heel was originally for use in riding horses, then became a men’s style of shoe as a height elevator, then women started using them to mimic mens’ position of power, the origin tends to become eroded over time.

        38. Analogies only work if they are factually correct to begin with for both parts. If not, then the sarcasm radio shoots to the proportion of a fourth generation twinkee measuring approximately 35 feet long writing about 600 lbs.

          Unless you ate trying to use a culture reference. Then it must be used correctly for all tenets to allow for a maximum effect. I.e.: reasoning, humor, etc. Otherwise, you’re just blowing smoke. Because money talks and bullshit walks. And another one would be, “birds of a feather flock together. “

        39. It’s just the way my mind works. I remember a lot of things, but names, faces and specific analogies aren’t on that list.

        40. I ran into a saying I saw attributed to the Druids. It was one of many in a long list of “wisdom of threes” sort of thing. The one that struck me and I still remember was:

          The three things a man is: What he thinks he is, what others think he is, and what he truly is.

          When I first ran across that, as a junior in high school, I immediately gravitated to the first and last item, as I knew that there were parts of myself that I wasn’t aware of and recognized that part of me was what I wasn’t aware, but what I truly was was still shaped and impacted by what I thought of myself. I thought the second was ridiculous and wrong, as that couldn’t matter. Over the span of a few years, I started to recognize that the first and third items were strongly shaped by my experiences, and I came to recognize that the experiences that presented themselves to me were very strongly impacted by that second item. What others have thought of me changed what I’ve been able to experience. Sure, I could’ve pushed hard and experienced specific things without that, but I would’ve had to know I wanted that experience and spent a lot of time working towards it that might’ve been spent in other experiences otherwise.

          That’s where your birth and, if you aren’t adopted, the accompanying environment you grow up in comes in. There were times growing up when my parents had very little money, but my nearby grandparents were relatively wealthy, so that put me growing up in an environment where I couldn’t have as much of what I wanted as a lot of other kids, but I never lacked something I truly needed. I was definitely shaped by that, as was my brother.

          Lots of genetic dispositions will alter a person’s potential experiences. Intelligence, attractiveness, disposition, willpower, athletic ability, general health, and sometimes gender & race too. Sometimes being a certain race or gender opens a person to discrimination, but othertimes it opens them to opportunities that they might not otherwise have. Gender-based example, there’re some large pushes in some areas to get more women interested in STEM areas. The boys aren’t discouraged or anything, but there’s a concerted effort to try to appeal and assist more women in moving in that direction. One of the ladies at work is involved in that sort of group. There’s absolutely nothing wrong about it, and it’s an attempt to correct of a very real gender imbalance in many STEM fields, but it does show a difference in opportunities for experience.

          So, I won’t say that I believe that race is as big of an issue as some people like to yell about, but it can matter and change opportunities, sometimes for perfectly good/benign reasons that no one would question.

        41. No reasons, outside of the wondering of what STEM meant. But couldn’t one say, “sciences” and still mean the same thing? Or have we changed so much as a culture to where we need to differentiate between generations by continuously reinventing the wheel in a linguistic way?

          If we have to keep including those who don’t know by way of dangling a twinkee instead of say, a carrot, apple or a fish, then how are we going to genuinely get people to be interested in something they like and let them dove into it headstrong instead of just dropping them into the figgy pudding?

        42. In some ways, I dislike the acronym STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering, and Math). Primarily I dislike “Technology” being in there. Science and Engineering are distinctly different in ways I personally consider important, and internally have the division in my mind of Science Mindset vs Engineering Mindset (Science is about discovering something, Engineering is about taking things already discovered and making something useful). Additionally Math can be considered more “pure” than Science also as it’s realm is entirely internal, and other than being more fundimental, isn’t really separate from Science (my degree was a BS in Computer Science, and I’ve always considered Computer Science to be the Engineering to Math’s Science).

          So, basically I do use the acronym STEM when I want to capture more of the flavor than just Science or Engineering alone and don’t feel like typing it out. Also the programs I’m aware of all use it, so it’s embedded in my thoughts of those programs.

          As for why to encourage an underrepresented grouping in a field, that depends on the field. My mom works at a public library near the school I went to and they recently hired their first male full-time staff member (they had some male interns/summer workers from the nearby high school previously). I don’t think that actually matters one way or the other because being a librarian is curating knowlege and assisting others to find it, so rarely would I expect viewpoint differences to matter. On the other hand, when you look at software development, that’s basically a practice of taking the way you think and putting it down in writing. For smaller projects (1-3 developers) you’ll probably get better results with a homogenous team, but for larger (10+ developers) you can start to see benefits with a more diverse team. Basically if your project is small enough that you don’t need to do a lot of merging between the different ways people think anyway, it’ll go smoother with more similarity, so as long as you have decent specs you’re good. If your project is larger you’re going to have to deal with merging one person’s throught patterns with another more often anyway, so a greater diversity in the way people think can lead to a longer development process (more arguments on peer reviews, more time when merging changes to others’ work) but a better end result as you’ll have more ideas competing with each other. The proviso to small projects is that you frequently don’t have good specs, so having a diversity in the developers to more closely cover the users of the system can help make up for that sort of shortfall. The proviso to large projects is sometimes the people whose ideas are farther away from the norm get more combative and hostile, and that antagonism tends to make them a net loss instead of a net gain. Additionally, specifically for women, from what I’ve read research-wise women (in the US, and probably generally in the western world at least) tend to be raised to be more peacemakers and conciliators, and some studies into management style and teamwork have shown those tendencies to produce positive results later in life.

          So, in short, I see some degree of encouragement to be a very useful thing, as long as we’re not talking big bucks or things that actively discourage the other side (and I’ve never seen either of them for women in STEM programs, though I have seen some big bucks for the encouraging young people of both genders into STEM fields and some of those have soft targets to try to get a closer gender balance, as in not less than 30% or so which can take effort).

      3. The ending to the last arc is a Patreon bonus. The good news is, if you sub to Patreon in the future (like I’m planning to) the strips will still be there–there’s no clock waiting to run out.

      4. Advantages and disadvantages tend to go hand in hand in my experience. A lot of time things are balanced heavily one way or the other, but there are generally touches of the other side in any situation. As a white male, I’ve seen people being discriminated against for being black, but I’ve also seen them get a pass they wouldn’t have if they were white due to the authority figure being concerned about it seeming racist even though it definitely wasn’t. I suspect the first outweighs the second, but the second definitely exists too.

        I found some of his conclusions a bit too far myself (if he’s never run into true evil that goes beyond what he explains, then he’s a lucky man), but I’ve seen bits and pieces that can see where what seemed to be the origin of his statements came from.

        As to your second question, the ending to Pumpkin’s story is unfinished, but will only appear on Patreon (for now).

    3. You know, I don’t know how to respond to this, and I feel that I need to say something. Maybe something short and succinct, instead of just a “yep” or a “^^this” or a quote from popular mass media.

      It’s definitely something to think about.

        1. There were things to agree with and things to disagree with in that original comment. After a long drawn out argument you’ll tend to see more of the second type.

  10. My likely answer to question No. 6 would have been:
    “Who cares? This is ART 130.”

    I mean, odds are 10 to 1 the professor dropped out of art school.

  11. Okay, comic-related comment now:

    “So mister, what did you need this spot for anyway?”
    “I need to sit behind a table and watch a busty girl hand out flyers.”
    “Moooooomm!!”

  12. That final assignment… my gods… Seriously my answer to the ‘why haven’t you done as much as these artists who were your age?’ would’ve been, “Well, for starters, they didn’t waste time and money in classes like this one.”

    1. Haha!

      “What are the biggest differences between these artists and you?”
      “I am answering pointless questions while they are busy making art.”

      1. Quite honestly: The utter and complete dick who thought out this question would have definitely deserved that for an answer. I’ve studied myself for some time and I’ve never seen anything as condescending, inappropriate and outright insufferable as this question.
        Seriously. If I was a person in charge at a college and a student showed me a question like this written in an assignment, I’d have a very serious talk with the professor in question. If it happened again, I’d see to it that he is let go. Because he’s obviously at the wrong place.
        I might have been able to let it slide if it stopped at “…why aren’t you doing similarly influential work in your disciplines by now?” That could yet be treated as an actual mandate to review your own work. But the rest is nothing more than one big insulting rant about “those giddamn young ones that don’t git of me lawn!”

        Then without it being part of the assignment just put these sentences at the bottom: “Consider that the only thing standing in the way of you becoming the best graphic designer you can be is you. Not your situation, not your tools, not your teachers, but you.”
        But clearly apart from the questions and without the rest of the paragraph. Because these two sentences actually work quite well as a motivator if used like that.

        1. Time for the good old RELATIONCHART!

          Someone got a warehouse to store it? We want to note down speculated relations too!

        2. Maybe if I find the time one of these days. Not sure if it’s the right place for pure speculations though.

        3. There’s plenty of speculations there to start with, so I wouldn’t worry about that. I’ve done a couple of small updates, but it’s been months since anything other than that has happened there. A relationship chart would fit if you feel like putting the time in. I was certainly using it as a scratchpad to keep track of references to things stated in comics or comments, I just worded them to be helpful/useful to others and filled out a few other things while I was at it.

  13. My answer to #6 would be easy:

    Uhhh… You do realize that this is an elective and most of us aren’t planning to be graphic designers, right? Also there’s a growing trend of people interested in life for, well life, and not as a vector for having a career. I plan to work to live, not live to work. If you want to live to work, good for you and I wish you the best, but I won’t be joining you in that.

  14. I thought it sounded more like a “rate this class” survey than a final. It would be easy to say that a lot of the course was a rehash of this amazing course you took in high school.

    As to question 6, School lasts significantly longer than it used to(and requires more diversity in education, and more time spent taking standardized tests instead of learning) , and child labor laws prevent apprenticeships at the ages that most artists would have begun learning their trade. They learned from masters, not middle school teachers with art minors in some liberal arts college somewhere. Yes, we can see great masterpieces with the touch of a button, but good luck finding directions on how to produce it. Unless the professor is a modern day daVinci, he probably plodded along the same path of mediocrity that he’s complaining about. For that matter, if the class is required for that degree, he’s perpetuating the problem, especially since our society has migrated towards the “you need a degree to succeed” and “you need experience to get this job, but you can’t get the job without experience” attitudes.

    Of course, unless the professor is highly impressed with people who stand up to him/her, that’s not the kind of response that is going to get a good grade.

  15. I just realized that despite Danny’s extremely questionable ability to interact with children this is really a step up for him. What I mean by that is that it appears he’s about to actually set up some of kind display instead of just dragging Ellie to a new bizarre locale. Is this a new, more serious Danny? Is this the turning point where he starts taking his job seriously and starts making money instead of just wasting it? Is he going to attempt to the girl scout cookies at a markup to recoup some of his losses?

    1. I don’t want to crush your dreams. But I think he just realised that Ellie would definitely see through him just dragging her to a supermarket if he wasn’t putting up at least some kind of display.
      Which pretty much just is setting up a table in front of it from the looks of it. Not exactly what I would call vast preparations.

      He might try to sell the cookies at a higher price though. But I don’t think he will. At best maybe use them as an additional incentive “Here, have a flyer. And a cookie!”

        1. It’s a good plan, actually! Don’t know if he’ll come up with it (or even has a chance to). Let’s see.

        2. Sorry, but when I read Monroe lately, my first thought is always a certain vegetarian Blutbad.

          I love that series!

        1. And might even remember the web adress from it, later get curious and look it up. That’s the whole point of it, really.

  16. I agree with the rant. People try to make guilt where none has been or should be over stuff that’s simply stupid. All I gotta say is just be glad you don’t live in Germany, where even during their hosting of the World Cup I knew a few over there and they related the uneasiness and awkwardness of everyone being like
    “can we wave our flag, shout go Germany, and Germany is the Best, is it ok? Cause of allt he guilt they have from their past. So it could be worse. But yeah I feel you.

    Anyway, That’s a shit ton of cookies he just bought, Like easily around 4 dollars worth. Where is he getting this money? I know he’s taking from the site funds, but unless his partners linked their direct bank accounts where is all the money coming from?

        1. It sucks that the Manji still gets regularly blasted because of it similarity to the swastika.

          And apparently auto correct wants to make swastika into Swaziland for me. “No one would ever discuss swastikas, he must mean Swaziland!”

        2. Yeah, the Hakenkreuz was hardly a invention of the nazis. As with most of their ideology or symbols actually, they just ripped it of somewhere else because they liked it for some reason.
          It’s a pity that this thousands of years old symbol, usually a lucky one, that has found itself in one form or other nearly all over the world in completely different cultures has now such a bad rep due to a bunch of bastards using it for about one and half a decade.

        3. Damn near every civilization on the planet had our has some form of that basic artistic/geometric design associated with its culture. Bend things to the left, and so on until it can look distinguished from previous graphic artists who had less than you. Then bend it to the right, because those graphic artists lived in desperate times with eat and famine.

  17. Sorry just had to answer number 1 also.

    1. What are the 3 biggest insights you gained about the Principles of Design by taking this course?

    -> 1) What a wasted amount of money I have spent.
    -> 2) They overpay teachers.
    -> 3) If I can’t do Design, I can teach people about it.

    6. Finally, what did you learn by watching your fellow classmates presentations on their artists? What did most of these artists have in common? Considering that they were in their 20’s when they did much of their work, and many of you are in your 20’s, why aren’t you doing similarly influential work in your disciplines by now? They didn’t have more means than you in many cases, and frankly lived in much more turbulent and difficult times… What are the biggest differences between these artists and you? Consider the following points before you answer:
    • They didn’t have computers or the technology you have.
    • Many of them lived during turbulent wars or periods of conflict.
    • They didn’t have the internet and yet they were aware of what was happening in their industry…
    Consider that the only thing standing in the way of you becoming the best graphic designer you can be is you. Not your situation, not your tools, not your teachers, but you. Consider for a moment what each of the artists was willing to give to become as great as they were… consider what they did with their idle time. How they spent their youth… what they were able to accomplish at such a young age… etc

    That most people only remember the successful people. They forget that for every one successful person out there there are 99 who did the same thing but weren’t as successful. The biggest difference is that they were lucky/had good timing. You need to persevere, not throw common sense out the window at how you must “suffer” for your art.

  18. Yech. I’m surprised the teacher got away with question 6. Whoops, I know why! Because this isn’t a teacher, it’s a PROFESSOR. They have complete reign and are able to get into teaching without actually knowing how to teach. They may be an expert in their field, but NO idea how to teach. And then you get questions like this, where no actual teaching is done. Just a bunch of garbage that they feel is suppose to “make you think.”

    There are indeed some amazing professors out there that are able to help you along and have you come to conclusions on your own, but this is NOT the way to do it. It’s lazy. It demeans the student, as if to say “nothing you do will ever be enough, and I’m teaching you that it’s a GOOD thing to feel terrible all the time.” I know that it helps you to strive to be better, but “striving” comes from feeling good, not terrible. Sure, you can see where your work is crap, but you KNOW it’s your best for now, and you KNOW you can do better later. If you’re just focusing on how much more everyone before you had done at a much younger age, you’ll just wonder why you’re even bothering.

  19. Ugh. Why do webcomics always misrepresent how cookie sales actually work? At least this one is less offensive than most that I’ve seen.

    1. Don’t know how cookie sales go down. We only ever did cake sales (yeah, I was a boyscout for some over a decade. Or should I say active boyscout, because you never really stop being one). And we had both, going door to door in residential areas as well as set up a table in town centre and sell from there to passers-by (which would look quite similar to what you see in this comic, actually).

        1. Boy Scout Troops are much more individual and each is privately owned by a charter organization, meaning they have much more freedom. Girl Scouts is run on a much more national level and is charter by congress, meaning there’s a lot less freedom for individual troops.

        2. I see both your boy- and girlscouts are organised entirely different from ours. For starters, it’s the same organisation for both of them around here. Also a very federalistic one.

      1. My brother was a Boy Scout, and my dad was the leader of the troop as well as the popcorn colonel for the council. My mom was a girl scout “cookie mom” and I was a top cookie seller for 13 years (I have had a long scouting career). Boy Scouts is MUCH more lax about rules than Girl Scouts.

      1. I guess my biggest problem is the fact that the adult is not present. That is a HUGE no-no. Girl Scouts is really strict on rules and etiquette for sales to the point where I have taught classes on sale etiquette to new scouts. Some of the following are things that have gotten scouts in my city kicked out of stores or at least got scouts into trouble with the service unit:
        -Visible use of cellphone when customers are present
        -Speaking with disrespect to customer (Yes, even drunk customers that won’t leave you alone)
        -Sitting down
        -Eating within view of customer
        -Setting up your table too close to the flower display or the door
        -Adult not present
        -Scout keeping the bank (due to safety concerns, only adults get to hold the bank)
        -Talking to employees too much

        I know you’re from a different area, so maybe things are different because things vary from council to council, but things in GSWW are super strict. If a scout screws up (and there have been huge screw-ups), that can mean the store calling the person in charge of sales for the service unit to report you and even the loss of a store for sales. One year some mom of a scout decided to mark up their cookies an extra buck and pocket the extra cash and we lost the right to sell at that chain for two years.

        I’d like to say that this isn’t a personal condemnation on you, as this isn’t that bad, but more like a vent about a lot of comics. A few webcomics have even shown girl scouts as gangs that chase people down and violently force them to buy cookies.

        1. A few webcomics have even shown girl scouts as gangs that chase people down and violently force them to buy cookies.

          Granted, that is usually done for comedic value alone and rather obviously not meant as an example of real life behaviour.

        2. Yeah, but it doesn’t stop it from being annoying and slightly offensive. After all, feminists get annoyed when comics portray them badly, different religious groups get annoyed, everyone gets annoyed by negative portrayals of their group, even if it is in comedic form. I understand a lot of the comics are “funny,” but I’ve never seen a positive portrayal of any female scouting group in a comic (not GS, Girl Guides, Sea Scouts, Campfire… etc.). I have seen a couple positive examples of boy scouts, though. For some reason a lot of people gloss over the fact girl scouts do just as much community service as boy scouts and tend to write girl scouts as being annoying and boy scouts as these amazing outstanding citizens.

        3. I’d have a hard time actually finding the precise links, but I’ve seen some positive examples for girlscouts as well. Mostly though, I only very rarely find them in comics at all.

          As for the first point: Actually I found that usually a majority of the given group doesn’t take a comedic portrayal of them annoying and offensive. That is not true for all members of that group, obviously. Also some groups are more easily offended than others. (Heck, with some it’s enough to say “I disagree” and you’re already on their list. They’re like Kat if she had a prejudiced and arrogant character and were completely blinkered in her view of the world. If you get what I mean.)
          Your mileage may vary of course. So don’t see this as an accusation or me telling you to shut up and suck it. Not in the least! If you don’t like it, you’re free to think so and tell about it. Especially considering you were very civil in doing so. That’s not something everybody manages.

        4. I don’t think I’ve seen boy scouts in comics be anything but the butt of a joke. Either something ridiculous about merit badges or the person something bad happens to or who’s standing at the wrong place at the wrong time. So I think your milage may vary depending on the comic.

          But I’d also like to agree that your annoyance is perfectly rational, calmly stated, fair, and all that sort of thing, so this wasn’t meant as an attempt at dissuading you but just an attempt at a hopeful note that perhaps it’s just due to the sample set you read (my list of webcomics I mean to get back to is much longer than the ones I read, and the list of ones I read is >40).

        5. Maybe the adult couldn’t find a spot to park close enough to watch what was going on (that, or she was just gullible enough to think that she could just make one trip) and get the cookies there before Danny did.

        6. Nah, they would’ve directed him to talk to the adult if an adult was present but just grabbing a bathroom break. While I know absolutely nothing about girl scouts, I’d actually noticed the lack of an adult as unlikely-for-real-life-but-necessary-for-flow-of-chosen-joke as well.

  20. As a girl scout, buying ALL the cookies from an average sale would cost about $576.00.

    Also, proper sale etiquette is when you sell out, contact the person in your troop storing the troop’s cookies for the sale and have them bring you more. You don’t leave when you sell out unless it’s towards the end of the season and there isn’t more cookies to bring or it’s already close to the end of your shift anyway and there isn’t enough time left to make it worth it. Scouts can actually get in trouble for leaving early.
    Also, there’s the fact that (at least where I’m from) it’s very uncommon to have that many scouts at one sale, after all, sales are divided equally and sometimes having a lot of girls at one sale means everyone works for four hours only to get credit for two boxes of cookies sold.
    My biggest problem with how many comics portray cookie sales is the fact that there is always an adult present. ALWAYS. To the point of remember to pee before the sale because if you’re the adult you are getting no bathroom breaks. A girl selling alone is literally the biggest no-no in all of cookie sales yet I have never once read a comic with GS cookies where there was any sort of adult supervision.

    Anyway, sorry for the rant, just sick of of the fact no one every takes the time to just check the rules.
    I’m really glad the one scout called him on his BS, though. Stores will sometimes not allow cookie sales because they have something else scheduled in the same month. One year we lost Safeway for the entire cookie season because they had a food drive (of course, Safeway is always harder to work with that other store chains, they just seem to not like charities and non-profits as much. I’ve had to arrange stuff with them and they’re always impossible and the higher-ups tend to be jerks).

    1. Well I did omit a line where the girl says her mom is just inside the store, but yeah.. it’s a comic. Lord knows I’ve bent enough rules or reality already.

      1. And that was a good thing. Changing names always makes it easier in fiction to paradise parts while bending reality. I do that a lot with things like comic series and games in my own webcomic.

    2. I think it would’ve been harder for the joke to work with an adult present. I suppose Danny could’ve directly bribed the adult, but otherwise I don’t see how that could’ve worked for Danny to get that spot. It’s also funnier for a grown man to bribe children rather than an adult.

  21. Ha ha. I have actually written college essays about cookie sales. Like, don’t even get me started, I have stories and peeves up the yinyang after 13 years of that BS.

  22. I couldn’t help but read that question and think if the Asian dad meme- yes, why aren’t you doing more with your skills yet? That question deserves a total ‘on the psychologists couch’ answer.

    1. Yeah, I love it when arguments get all meta. Wait, no, not love, uh, the other thing.

      It’s also fun to try to derail the argument (e.g. requesting showtunes) and see who all is taking it so seriously that they just blow right past the silly stuff and keep fighting.

      1. After a certain point, I find myself glazing past the argument and focusing on the derail-y bits. Kinda’ depends on the topic and argument style. Once it gets to be too much work for a passtime to keep track of the points of the argument, that’s when I focus on the showtunes (or equivalent).

  23. Rusche, I just had a deja vu moment. I was talking with my wife about one of her final assignments. ART130, Graphic Design, exact same question. My wife would like to know where your friend goes to school. Email me, if it is ok with the friend. I bristled at the question when I first read it and agree with your rant. I wonder if this is just some canned idiocy that is being passed of as ‘educational’. Particularly if the same final question set is coming from two different schools/professors (adjunct faculty). Here is my wife’s actual answer (with permission):

    “I don’t think it is possible to answer this question in a way that is acceptable. To me this makes me feel inadequate, lacking, lazy, inept, etc…. There are any number of reasons why a designer is able to find favor in his time. Most times it is passion, drive and probably a few connections that help to launch an artist in a young age. Many times it is that they are happen to be ready to deliver what society is ready to accept. As in Vignelli’s case, clean type when the world was used to funky stylized busy type and logos. New and different are good if that is what the world is ready to receive. Thirty years ago pink hair made people drop their jaws and immediately mistrust the offender. (I know. I was the offender.) Now pink hair is common place. Times dictate acceptance. For the artists to stay abreast of their field they immersed themselves in that world. Knoll was not then and is not now a mainstream company. It is an elite company catering to Interior Designers and Architects. If a graphic designer is going to make a name for himself in the design community it only makes sense to align himself with like minded companies. I do not compare myself to any of these artists. My life was not meant to be driven by one purpose that does not align with my focus on my family and what best meets their needs. What I can do is impart my love of art and culture to my children and inspire in them a desire to express their own creativity, however it manifests in them. Be it music, photography, design, or even creating videos and games. “

      1. Different school. Same poorly developed course material. For what it is worth her instructor commented on her final submission that he was uncomfortable with that final guilt trip “question” and had made that known up his chain of command. Thanks for the response, Rusche.

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